Issues with new Macs: hardware makes them difficult to use … what options might be available in the...

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Issues with new Macs: hardware makes them difficult to use … what options might be available in the future?


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1















AT home and at work I have acquired the MacBook Pro 2015 - which is the last one before the following hardware changes :




  • butterfly keyboard

  • overly large trackpad that causes palm-clicks

  • Touchbar


Each of those alone is a significant issue for me:




  • The existing MacBook is already not a good keyboard for me: I do need the tactile aspect of keys with 'travel'. My typos on a MBPro keyboard are already much higher than on an external keyboard

  • I do work on the move so an external keyboard only is an option a fraction of the time.

  • I rest my palms on the laptop so the large trackpad will induce yet more typos

  • My fingers look for the specific function keys: the Touchbar does not work


    • I do not use smart phones more than just for typing (precariously) because of the lack of physical keyboard . This is after years of trying; it is not working for me. That carries over to the mac and its Touchbar.




If I could buy a non-Apple / non-Mac there would be no issue. But I must use a Mac: all teams that I have worked on for five years only use Macs: and we must use IT supported configurations. Windows is a non-starter for an open source developer and pure linux would work fine (for home) but in the (larger) companies it is not supported (security apps, wifi, productivity apps etc)



I am constantly in trouble with memory usage due to running heavy and large application codebases along with vm's, browsers, and productivity apps. The maximum 16GB on the older macs will eventually simply not be sufficient.



The IT Ops folks do not use new macs and use the old ones. All co-workers that have been around long enough use the old macs and also refuse to upgrade. So I have not run into anyone with solutions for this yet.



Does anyone have a plan for how to handle this ?










share|improve this question

























  • Thanks for the edits. I would love nothing more to have a real substantive, reasoned discussion that’s “good subjective” and not seen as just a rant. Please ping me if the discussion gets off the rails (or another mod in the chat room). There are going to be strong opinions on this. Here is the specific guidance on “what not to ask” apple.stackexchange.com/help/dont-ask

    – bmike
    2 hours ago













  • Thanks bmike I know this is treading the line and welcome the advice on either how to keep it "in bounds" or have to remove it if not possible. I work on a mac 10 to 14 hours a day 350 days a year. Macos is the most productive platform and often enough the only supported choice.

    – javadba
    2 hours ago













  • Further updated the post to try to remove the subjective / negative words.

    – javadba
    1 hour ago
















1















AT home and at work I have acquired the MacBook Pro 2015 - which is the last one before the following hardware changes :




  • butterfly keyboard

  • overly large trackpad that causes palm-clicks

  • Touchbar


Each of those alone is a significant issue for me:




  • The existing MacBook is already not a good keyboard for me: I do need the tactile aspect of keys with 'travel'. My typos on a MBPro keyboard are already much higher than on an external keyboard

  • I do work on the move so an external keyboard only is an option a fraction of the time.

  • I rest my palms on the laptop so the large trackpad will induce yet more typos

  • My fingers look for the specific function keys: the Touchbar does not work


    • I do not use smart phones more than just for typing (precariously) because of the lack of physical keyboard . This is after years of trying; it is not working for me. That carries over to the mac and its Touchbar.




If I could buy a non-Apple / non-Mac there would be no issue. But I must use a Mac: all teams that I have worked on for five years only use Macs: and we must use IT supported configurations. Windows is a non-starter for an open source developer and pure linux would work fine (for home) but in the (larger) companies it is not supported (security apps, wifi, productivity apps etc)



I am constantly in trouble with memory usage due to running heavy and large application codebases along with vm's, browsers, and productivity apps. The maximum 16GB on the older macs will eventually simply not be sufficient.



The IT Ops folks do not use new macs and use the old ones. All co-workers that have been around long enough use the old macs and also refuse to upgrade. So I have not run into anyone with solutions for this yet.



Does anyone have a plan for how to handle this ?










share|improve this question

























  • Thanks for the edits. I would love nothing more to have a real substantive, reasoned discussion that’s “good subjective” and not seen as just a rant. Please ping me if the discussion gets off the rails (or another mod in the chat room). There are going to be strong opinions on this. Here is the specific guidance on “what not to ask” apple.stackexchange.com/help/dont-ask

    – bmike
    2 hours ago













  • Thanks bmike I know this is treading the line and welcome the advice on either how to keep it "in bounds" or have to remove it if not possible. I work on a mac 10 to 14 hours a day 350 days a year. Macos is the most productive platform and often enough the only supported choice.

    – javadba
    2 hours ago













  • Further updated the post to try to remove the subjective / negative words.

    – javadba
    1 hour ago














1












1








1








AT home and at work I have acquired the MacBook Pro 2015 - which is the last one before the following hardware changes :




  • butterfly keyboard

  • overly large trackpad that causes palm-clicks

  • Touchbar


Each of those alone is a significant issue for me:




  • The existing MacBook is already not a good keyboard for me: I do need the tactile aspect of keys with 'travel'. My typos on a MBPro keyboard are already much higher than on an external keyboard

  • I do work on the move so an external keyboard only is an option a fraction of the time.

  • I rest my palms on the laptop so the large trackpad will induce yet more typos

  • My fingers look for the specific function keys: the Touchbar does not work


    • I do not use smart phones more than just for typing (precariously) because of the lack of physical keyboard . This is after years of trying; it is not working for me. That carries over to the mac and its Touchbar.




If I could buy a non-Apple / non-Mac there would be no issue. But I must use a Mac: all teams that I have worked on for five years only use Macs: and we must use IT supported configurations. Windows is a non-starter for an open source developer and pure linux would work fine (for home) but in the (larger) companies it is not supported (security apps, wifi, productivity apps etc)



I am constantly in trouble with memory usage due to running heavy and large application codebases along with vm's, browsers, and productivity apps. The maximum 16GB on the older macs will eventually simply not be sufficient.



The IT Ops folks do not use new macs and use the old ones. All co-workers that have been around long enough use the old macs and also refuse to upgrade. So I have not run into anyone with solutions for this yet.



Does anyone have a plan for how to handle this ?










share|improve this question
















AT home and at work I have acquired the MacBook Pro 2015 - which is the last one before the following hardware changes :




  • butterfly keyboard

  • overly large trackpad that causes palm-clicks

  • Touchbar


Each of those alone is a significant issue for me:




  • The existing MacBook is already not a good keyboard for me: I do need the tactile aspect of keys with 'travel'. My typos on a MBPro keyboard are already much higher than on an external keyboard

  • I do work on the move so an external keyboard only is an option a fraction of the time.

  • I rest my palms on the laptop so the large trackpad will induce yet more typos

  • My fingers look for the specific function keys: the Touchbar does not work


    • I do not use smart phones more than just for typing (precariously) because of the lack of physical keyboard . This is after years of trying; it is not working for me. That carries over to the mac and its Touchbar.




If I could buy a non-Apple / non-Mac there would be no issue. But I must use a Mac: all teams that I have worked on for five years only use Macs: and we must use IT supported configurations. Windows is a non-starter for an open source developer and pure linux would work fine (for home) but in the (larger) companies it is not supported (security apps, wifi, productivity apps etc)



I am constantly in trouble with memory usage due to running heavy and large application codebases along with vm's, browsers, and productivity apps. The maximum 16GB on the older macs will eventually simply not be sufficient.



The IT Ops folks do not use new macs and use the old ones. All co-workers that have been around long enough use the old macs and also refuse to upgrade. So I have not run into anyone with solutions for this yet.



Does anyone have a plan for how to handle this ?







macbook






share|improve this question















share|improve this question













share|improve this question




share|improve this question








edited 34 mins ago









LangLangC

4,25531757




4,25531757










asked 2 hours ago









javadbajavadba

1,24461838




1,24461838













  • Thanks for the edits. I would love nothing more to have a real substantive, reasoned discussion that’s “good subjective” and not seen as just a rant. Please ping me if the discussion gets off the rails (or another mod in the chat room). There are going to be strong opinions on this. Here is the specific guidance on “what not to ask” apple.stackexchange.com/help/dont-ask

    – bmike
    2 hours ago













  • Thanks bmike I know this is treading the line and welcome the advice on either how to keep it "in bounds" or have to remove it if not possible. I work on a mac 10 to 14 hours a day 350 days a year. Macos is the most productive platform and often enough the only supported choice.

    – javadba
    2 hours ago













  • Further updated the post to try to remove the subjective / negative words.

    – javadba
    1 hour ago



















  • Thanks for the edits. I would love nothing more to have a real substantive, reasoned discussion that’s “good subjective” and not seen as just a rant. Please ping me if the discussion gets off the rails (or another mod in the chat room). There are going to be strong opinions on this. Here is the specific guidance on “what not to ask” apple.stackexchange.com/help/dont-ask

    – bmike
    2 hours ago













  • Thanks bmike I know this is treading the line and welcome the advice on either how to keep it "in bounds" or have to remove it if not possible. I work on a mac 10 to 14 hours a day 350 days a year. Macos is the most productive platform and often enough the only supported choice.

    – javadba
    2 hours ago













  • Further updated the post to try to remove the subjective / negative words.

    – javadba
    1 hour ago

















Thanks for the edits. I would love nothing more to have a real substantive, reasoned discussion that’s “good subjective” and not seen as just a rant. Please ping me if the discussion gets off the rails (or another mod in the chat room). There are going to be strong opinions on this. Here is the specific guidance on “what not to ask” apple.stackexchange.com/help/dont-ask

– bmike
2 hours ago







Thanks for the edits. I would love nothing more to have a real substantive, reasoned discussion that’s “good subjective” and not seen as just a rant. Please ping me if the discussion gets off the rails (or another mod in the chat room). There are going to be strong opinions on this. Here is the specific guidance on “what not to ask” apple.stackexchange.com/help/dont-ask

– bmike
2 hours ago















Thanks bmike I know this is treading the line and welcome the advice on either how to keep it "in bounds" or have to remove it if not possible. I work on a mac 10 to 14 hours a day 350 days a year. Macos is the most productive platform and often enough the only supported choice.

– javadba
2 hours ago







Thanks bmike I know this is treading the line and welcome the advice on either how to keep it "in bounds" or have to remove it if not possible. I work on a mac 10 to 14 hours a day 350 days a year. Macos is the most productive platform and often enough the only supported choice.

– javadba
2 hours ago















Further updated the post to try to remove the subjective / negative words.

– javadba
1 hour ago





Further updated the post to try to remove the subjective / negative words.

– javadba
1 hour ago










2 Answers
2






active

oldest

votes


















2














Basically you're saying that you do not like any of the computers in the current Mac lineup, and also that you do not like any non-Mac.



If you look at that logically, then you have three options:



(a) Use only old Mac models, and live with slow performance.



(b) Hope that Apple introduces a model you like



(c) Build your own laptop that you actually like



As you state that (a) is "not sufficient", it's not an acceptable option for you. Option (c) is usually viable, unless you happen to have very specific skills or a lot of money to spend.



That leaves you with (b) - hope that Apple comes up with new models that you actually like.



Or you could do something radical and change your own opinions over time.






share|improve this answer
























  • I would add - Macs have huge resale value. If you buy a new Mac and get AppleCare - you can almost always sell it for list price or consider the depreciation for 3-4 months as “rent”. The new Air is awesome, and people that don’t like touchbar are loving it to death in my experience. Just buy a tool and sell it when it stops making you money or happy or you have a new tool.

    – bmike
    2 hours ago











  • I am already doing (a) as described in the post. At some point IT might stop supporting 4+ year old macs. Your comment about change opinion does not address the objective issues raised.

    – javadba
    2 hours ago













  • @javadba Actually it does. It is a very practical approach. You either have to hope that Apple makes something you like, use something you do not like - or change your likes. It is very simple. Unless ofcourse you think that you could yourself have a say in deciding which products Apple introduces to the market.

    – jksoegaard
    1 hour ago











  • The items listed in the question are not about items similar to which color schemes ("likes") but usability. There are specific hardware issues listed and their impact on productivity is mentioned. Unless by "like" it means: "preferring to type at a faster pace with many fewer mistakes". And given the large trackpad "avoid tiring of wrists due to needing to hold in an awkward position.".

    – javadba
    1 hour ago











  • @javadba You seem to be misunderstand what I'm saying. I'm aware that you're not complaining about the color of the computer. I'm also aware that you're complaining about things that are measurable truths - i.e. "I can scientifically prove that this laptop has a TouchBar installed". However you're not really getting anywhere with these observations. You're still left with the choice of using old computers, use newer computers that you do not like, building your own - or hoping that something even newer comes along that you actually want.

    – jksoegaard
    1 hour ago





















2














It's really imperative to observe a few things:



You want new hardware, and prefer Apple building it for you. That means choosing the right one for you, or influence Apple to cater to your needs, or make a compromise in needs, or look for workarounds and alternatives.





  1. Voice your wants and demands. Not necessarily just here (if this community even tolerates something like this and doesn't qualify it as "just a rant").



    But do two other things:

    write it directly to Apple (Feedback), and write to news outlets, magazines, blogs, your own pages. It is absolutely superfluous to cry and whine in private only to go out and pay good money for things you do not really want or need or like. Chances that this succeeds are small, but then at least you have tried and if others chime in in significant enough numbers, then maybe…



    Apple can see the numbers of sales, but not the non-sales. It can count complaints written to them or analysing reviews and net trends. Writing to them and the public increases the likelihood to have that opinion registered and properly weighted. If buyers rip the boxes off the shelves, you are indeed in an insignificant demographic. If sales slow and negative press increases, any intelligent business will have to adapt, somehow.



    If you buy from an online retailer, write a review that list your likes and dislikes fairly. Only praising a product is common, but absolutely uselesss, unlesss you're interested primarily in stock-market shares.



    Well written and constructive criticism is the most helpful thing to do. It helps others form an opinion and make a decision. And that includes Apple.



    But you have to be patient and wait, for a thing that may never materialise.



  2. Do not buy Apple products you are not and will not be satisfied with. New MacBook Pro is expensive and has a hated Touchbar? New MacBook Air will do performance wise or old MacBook Pro 2015? Then do not buy a 2016 MBP, but the one that does suite you, and write about your decision on a forum, blog etc.



  3. Analyse really carefully your 'musts', mustn'ts' and needs.



    In the question it states: "I must use a Mac". And then it lists a few 'reasons' to which I would still ask further: "Why, really?" The specifics are missing, really. Because you might opt for a Hackintosh or a virtualisation solution for almost everything Mac-only in terms of software.



    If it's just about the software to be run, then the two alternatives are worth looking into. If there are other reasons like policy or support within a team or company, then you might ask for exceptions.



  4. Try to look into workarounds. Hate the keyboard: try an external bluetooth. Hate the glossy screen… in general, try any hack you find.



  5. Join groups that have a shared goal for this kind of action.



    To&From Apple: Want a "greener laptop": work with Greenpeace to exert pressure. Want a "right to repair": support proposals for such legislation. Want a usable keyboard as your last butterfly one failed for the third time: join law suits and write about it.



    To&From your work groups: join a union or smaller group that fights for your right to choose the hardware you want, as long as it doesn't hamper the workflow or other policies.








share|improve this answer


























  • Thanks but in the question I did mention the must: the (larger) companies it [linux] is not supported (security apps, wifi, productivity apps etc) The OP was updated to emphasize that more.

    – javadba
    46 mins ago













  • @javadba For one, the above is for the generalised case (you are not alone in this, trust me). Second, unless specified, things like "SecurityApps" sound strange, are they in-house Mac-only (and asking for support/exceptions would still be on the table then, imho)? How can "WiFi" be mac-specific? So, is it really mac-only: like a security app that somehow leverages some T2 functionality already (fictional example) or 'only mac-supported' (but doable with alternatives). If it's killer app (for me it's only one really) that could go VirtualBox? Point 3 and the situation specifics are kickers

    – LangLangC
    39 mins ago











  • OK well I upvoted this answer too - it's well thought out. Will wait for more ideas before awarding.

    – javadba
    28 mins ago











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2 Answers
2






active

oldest

votes








2 Answers
2






active

oldest

votes









active

oldest

votes






active

oldest

votes









2














Basically you're saying that you do not like any of the computers in the current Mac lineup, and also that you do not like any non-Mac.



If you look at that logically, then you have three options:



(a) Use only old Mac models, and live with slow performance.



(b) Hope that Apple introduces a model you like



(c) Build your own laptop that you actually like



As you state that (a) is "not sufficient", it's not an acceptable option for you. Option (c) is usually viable, unless you happen to have very specific skills or a lot of money to spend.



That leaves you with (b) - hope that Apple comes up with new models that you actually like.



Or you could do something radical and change your own opinions over time.






share|improve this answer
























  • I would add - Macs have huge resale value. If you buy a new Mac and get AppleCare - you can almost always sell it for list price or consider the depreciation for 3-4 months as “rent”. The new Air is awesome, and people that don’t like touchbar are loving it to death in my experience. Just buy a tool and sell it when it stops making you money or happy or you have a new tool.

    – bmike
    2 hours ago











  • I am already doing (a) as described in the post. At some point IT might stop supporting 4+ year old macs. Your comment about change opinion does not address the objective issues raised.

    – javadba
    2 hours ago













  • @javadba Actually it does. It is a very practical approach. You either have to hope that Apple makes something you like, use something you do not like - or change your likes. It is very simple. Unless ofcourse you think that you could yourself have a say in deciding which products Apple introduces to the market.

    – jksoegaard
    1 hour ago











  • The items listed in the question are not about items similar to which color schemes ("likes") but usability. There are specific hardware issues listed and their impact on productivity is mentioned. Unless by "like" it means: "preferring to type at a faster pace with many fewer mistakes". And given the large trackpad "avoid tiring of wrists due to needing to hold in an awkward position.".

    – javadba
    1 hour ago











  • @javadba You seem to be misunderstand what I'm saying. I'm aware that you're not complaining about the color of the computer. I'm also aware that you're complaining about things that are measurable truths - i.e. "I can scientifically prove that this laptop has a TouchBar installed". However you're not really getting anywhere with these observations. You're still left with the choice of using old computers, use newer computers that you do not like, building your own - or hoping that something even newer comes along that you actually want.

    – jksoegaard
    1 hour ago


















2














Basically you're saying that you do not like any of the computers in the current Mac lineup, and also that you do not like any non-Mac.



If you look at that logically, then you have three options:



(a) Use only old Mac models, and live with slow performance.



(b) Hope that Apple introduces a model you like



(c) Build your own laptop that you actually like



As you state that (a) is "not sufficient", it's not an acceptable option for you. Option (c) is usually viable, unless you happen to have very specific skills or a lot of money to spend.



That leaves you with (b) - hope that Apple comes up with new models that you actually like.



Or you could do something radical and change your own opinions over time.






share|improve this answer
























  • I would add - Macs have huge resale value. If you buy a new Mac and get AppleCare - you can almost always sell it for list price or consider the depreciation for 3-4 months as “rent”. The new Air is awesome, and people that don’t like touchbar are loving it to death in my experience. Just buy a tool and sell it when it stops making you money or happy or you have a new tool.

    – bmike
    2 hours ago











  • I am already doing (a) as described in the post. At some point IT might stop supporting 4+ year old macs. Your comment about change opinion does not address the objective issues raised.

    – javadba
    2 hours ago













  • @javadba Actually it does. It is a very practical approach. You either have to hope that Apple makes something you like, use something you do not like - or change your likes. It is very simple. Unless ofcourse you think that you could yourself have a say in deciding which products Apple introduces to the market.

    – jksoegaard
    1 hour ago











  • The items listed in the question are not about items similar to which color schemes ("likes") but usability. There are specific hardware issues listed and their impact on productivity is mentioned. Unless by "like" it means: "preferring to type at a faster pace with many fewer mistakes". And given the large trackpad "avoid tiring of wrists due to needing to hold in an awkward position.".

    – javadba
    1 hour ago











  • @javadba You seem to be misunderstand what I'm saying. I'm aware that you're not complaining about the color of the computer. I'm also aware that you're complaining about things that are measurable truths - i.e. "I can scientifically prove that this laptop has a TouchBar installed". However you're not really getting anywhere with these observations. You're still left with the choice of using old computers, use newer computers that you do not like, building your own - or hoping that something even newer comes along that you actually want.

    – jksoegaard
    1 hour ago
















2












2








2







Basically you're saying that you do not like any of the computers in the current Mac lineup, and also that you do not like any non-Mac.



If you look at that logically, then you have three options:



(a) Use only old Mac models, and live with slow performance.



(b) Hope that Apple introduces a model you like



(c) Build your own laptop that you actually like



As you state that (a) is "not sufficient", it's not an acceptable option for you. Option (c) is usually viable, unless you happen to have very specific skills or a lot of money to spend.



That leaves you with (b) - hope that Apple comes up with new models that you actually like.



Or you could do something radical and change your own opinions over time.






share|improve this answer













Basically you're saying that you do not like any of the computers in the current Mac lineup, and also that you do not like any non-Mac.



If you look at that logically, then you have three options:



(a) Use only old Mac models, and live with slow performance.



(b) Hope that Apple introduces a model you like



(c) Build your own laptop that you actually like



As you state that (a) is "not sufficient", it's not an acceptable option for you. Option (c) is usually viable, unless you happen to have very specific skills or a lot of money to spend.



That leaves you with (b) - hope that Apple comes up with new models that you actually like.



Or you could do something radical and change your own opinions over time.







share|improve this answer












share|improve this answer



share|improve this answer










answered 2 hours ago









jksoegaardjksoegaard

18k1949




18k1949













  • I would add - Macs have huge resale value. If you buy a new Mac and get AppleCare - you can almost always sell it for list price or consider the depreciation for 3-4 months as “rent”. The new Air is awesome, and people that don’t like touchbar are loving it to death in my experience. Just buy a tool and sell it when it stops making you money or happy or you have a new tool.

    – bmike
    2 hours ago











  • I am already doing (a) as described in the post. At some point IT might stop supporting 4+ year old macs. Your comment about change opinion does not address the objective issues raised.

    – javadba
    2 hours ago













  • @javadba Actually it does. It is a very practical approach. You either have to hope that Apple makes something you like, use something you do not like - or change your likes. It is very simple. Unless ofcourse you think that you could yourself have a say in deciding which products Apple introduces to the market.

    – jksoegaard
    1 hour ago











  • The items listed in the question are not about items similar to which color schemes ("likes") but usability. There are specific hardware issues listed and their impact on productivity is mentioned. Unless by "like" it means: "preferring to type at a faster pace with many fewer mistakes". And given the large trackpad "avoid tiring of wrists due to needing to hold in an awkward position.".

    – javadba
    1 hour ago











  • @javadba You seem to be misunderstand what I'm saying. I'm aware that you're not complaining about the color of the computer. I'm also aware that you're complaining about things that are measurable truths - i.e. "I can scientifically prove that this laptop has a TouchBar installed". However you're not really getting anywhere with these observations. You're still left with the choice of using old computers, use newer computers that you do not like, building your own - or hoping that something even newer comes along that you actually want.

    – jksoegaard
    1 hour ago





















  • I would add - Macs have huge resale value. If you buy a new Mac and get AppleCare - you can almost always sell it for list price or consider the depreciation for 3-4 months as “rent”. The new Air is awesome, and people that don’t like touchbar are loving it to death in my experience. Just buy a tool and sell it when it stops making you money or happy or you have a new tool.

    – bmike
    2 hours ago











  • I am already doing (a) as described in the post. At some point IT might stop supporting 4+ year old macs. Your comment about change opinion does not address the objective issues raised.

    – javadba
    2 hours ago













  • @javadba Actually it does. It is a very practical approach. You either have to hope that Apple makes something you like, use something you do not like - or change your likes. It is very simple. Unless ofcourse you think that you could yourself have a say in deciding which products Apple introduces to the market.

    – jksoegaard
    1 hour ago











  • The items listed in the question are not about items similar to which color schemes ("likes") but usability. There are specific hardware issues listed and their impact on productivity is mentioned. Unless by "like" it means: "preferring to type at a faster pace with many fewer mistakes". And given the large trackpad "avoid tiring of wrists due to needing to hold in an awkward position.".

    – javadba
    1 hour ago











  • @javadba You seem to be misunderstand what I'm saying. I'm aware that you're not complaining about the color of the computer. I'm also aware that you're complaining about things that are measurable truths - i.e. "I can scientifically prove that this laptop has a TouchBar installed". However you're not really getting anywhere with these observations. You're still left with the choice of using old computers, use newer computers that you do not like, building your own - or hoping that something even newer comes along that you actually want.

    – jksoegaard
    1 hour ago



















I would add - Macs have huge resale value. If you buy a new Mac and get AppleCare - you can almost always sell it for list price or consider the depreciation for 3-4 months as “rent”. The new Air is awesome, and people that don’t like touchbar are loving it to death in my experience. Just buy a tool and sell it when it stops making you money or happy or you have a new tool.

– bmike
2 hours ago





I would add - Macs have huge resale value. If you buy a new Mac and get AppleCare - you can almost always sell it for list price or consider the depreciation for 3-4 months as “rent”. The new Air is awesome, and people that don’t like touchbar are loving it to death in my experience. Just buy a tool and sell it when it stops making you money or happy or you have a new tool.

– bmike
2 hours ago













I am already doing (a) as described in the post. At some point IT might stop supporting 4+ year old macs. Your comment about change opinion does not address the objective issues raised.

– javadba
2 hours ago







I am already doing (a) as described in the post. At some point IT might stop supporting 4+ year old macs. Your comment about change opinion does not address the objective issues raised.

– javadba
2 hours ago















@javadba Actually it does. It is a very practical approach. You either have to hope that Apple makes something you like, use something you do not like - or change your likes. It is very simple. Unless ofcourse you think that you could yourself have a say in deciding which products Apple introduces to the market.

– jksoegaard
1 hour ago





@javadba Actually it does. It is a very practical approach. You either have to hope that Apple makes something you like, use something you do not like - or change your likes. It is very simple. Unless ofcourse you think that you could yourself have a say in deciding which products Apple introduces to the market.

– jksoegaard
1 hour ago













The items listed in the question are not about items similar to which color schemes ("likes") but usability. There are specific hardware issues listed and their impact on productivity is mentioned. Unless by "like" it means: "preferring to type at a faster pace with many fewer mistakes". And given the large trackpad "avoid tiring of wrists due to needing to hold in an awkward position.".

– javadba
1 hour ago





The items listed in the question are not about items similar to which color schemes ("likes") but usability. There are specific hardware issues listed and their impact on productivity is mentioned. Unless by "like" it means: "preferring to type at a faster pace with many fewer mistakes". And given the large trackpad "avoid tiring of wrists due to needing to hold in an awkward position.".

– javadba
1 hour ago













@javadba You seem to be misunderstand what I'm saying. I'm aware that you're not complaining about the color of the computer. I'm also aware that you're complaining about things that are measurable truths - i.e. "I can scientifically prove that this laptop has a TouchBar installed". However you're not really getting anywhere with these observations. You're still left with the choice of using old computers, use newer computers that you do not like, building your own - or hoping that something even newer comes along that you actually want.

– jksoegaard
1 hour ago







@javadba You seem to be misunderstand what I'm saying. I'm aware that you're not complaining about the color of the computer. I'm also aware that you're complaining about things that are measurable truths - i.e. "I can scientifically prove that this laptop has a TouchBar installed". However you're not really getting anywhere with these observations. You're still left with the choice of using old computers, use newer computers that you do not like, building your own - or hoping that something even newer comes along that you actually want.

– jksoegaard
1 hour ago















2














It's really imperative to observe a few things:



You want new hardware, and prefer Apple building it for you. That means choosing the right one for you, or influence Apple to cater to your needs, or make a compromise in needs, or look for workarounds and alternatives.





  1. Voice your wants and demands. Not necessarily just here (if this community even tolerates something like this and doesn't qualify it as "just a rant").



    But do two other things:

    write it directly to Apple (Feedback), and write to news outlets, magazines, blogs, your own pages. It is absolutely superfluous to cry and whine in private only to go out and pay good money for things you do not really want or need or like. Chances that this succeeds are small, but then at least you have tried and if others chime in in significant enough numbers, then maybe…



    Apple can see the numbers of sales, but not the non-sales. It can count complaints written to them or analysing reviews and net trends. Writing to them and the public increases the likelihood to have that opinion registered and properly weighted. If buyers rip the boxes off the shelves, you are indeed in an insignificant demographic. If sales slow and negative press increases, any intelligent business will have to adapt, somehow.



    If you buy from an online retailer, write a review that list your likes and dislikes fairly. Only praising a product is common, but absolutely uselesss, unlesss you're interested primarily in stock-market shares.



    Well written and constructive criticism is the most helpful thing to do. It helps others form an opinion and make a decision. And that includes Apple.



    But you have to be patient and wait, for a thing that may never materialise.



  2. Do not buy Apple products you are not and will not be satisfied with. New MacBook Pro is expensive and has a hated Touchbar? New MacBook Air will do performance wise or old MacBook Pro 2015? Then do not buy a 2016 MBP, but the one that does suite you, and write about your decision on a forum, blog etc.



  3. Analyse really carefully your 'musts', mustn'ts' and needs.



    In the question it states: "I must use a Mac". And then it lists a few 'reasons' to which I would still ask further: "Why, really?" The specifics are missing, really. Because you might opt for a Hackintosh or a virtualisation solution for almost everything Mac-only in terms of software.



    If it's just about the software to be run, then the two alternatives are worth looking into. If there are other reasons like policy or support within a team or company, then you might ask for exceptions.



  4. Try to look into workarounds. Hate the keyboard: try an external bluetooth. Hate the glossy screen… in general, try any hack you find.



  5. Join groups that have a shared goal for this kind of action.



    To&From Apple: Want a "greener laptop": work with Greenpeace to exert pressure. Want a "right to repair": support proposals for such legislation. Want a usable keyboard as your last butterfly one failed for the third time: join law suits and write about it.



    To&From your work groups: join a union or smaller group that fights for your right to choose the hardware you want, as long as it doesn't hamper the workflow or other policies.








share|improve this answer


























  • Thanks but in the question I did mention the must: the (larger) companies it [linux] is not supported (security apps, wifi, productivity apps etc) The OP was updated to emphasize that more.

    – javadba
    46 mins ago













  • @javadba For one, the above is for the generalised case (you are not alone in this, trust me). Second, unless specified, things like "SecurityApps" sound strange, are they in-house Mac-only (and asking for support/exceptions would still be on the table then, imho)? How can "WiFi" be mac-specific? So, is it really mac-only: like a security app that somehow leverages some T2 functionality already (fictional example) or 'only mac-supported' (but doable with alternatives). If it's killer app (for me it's only one really) that could go VirtualBox? Point 3 and the situation specifics are kickers

    – LangLangC
    39 mins ago











  • OK well I upvoted this answer too - it's well thought out. Will wait for more ideas before awarding.

    – javadba
    28 mins ago
















2














It's really imperative to observe a few things:



You want new hardware, and prefer Apple building it for you. That means choosing the right one for you, or influence Apple to cater to your needs, or make a compromise in needs, or look for workarounds and alternatives.





  1. Voice your wants and demands. Not necessarily just here (if this community even tolerates something like this and doesn't qualify it as "just a rant").



    But do two other things:

    write it directly to Apple (Feedback), and write to news outlets, magazines, blogs, your own pages. It is absolutely superfluous to cry and whine in private only to go out and pay good money for things you do not really want or need or like. Chances that this succeeds are small, but then at least you have tried and if others chime in in significant enough numbers, then maybe…



    Apple can see the numbers of sales, but not the non-sales. It can count complaints written to them or analysing reviews and net trends. Writing to them and the public increases the likelihood to have that opinion registered and properly weighted. If buyers rip the boxes off the shelves, you are indeed in an insignificant demographic. If sales slow and negative press increases, any intelligent business will have to adapt, somehow.



    If you buy from an online retailer, write a review that list your likes and dislikes fairly. Only praising a product is common, but absolutely uselesss, unlesss you're interested primarily in stock-market shares.



    Well written and constructive criticism is the most helpful thing to do. It helps others form an opinion and make a decision. And that includes Apple.



    But you have to be patient and wait, for a thing that may never materialise.



  2. Do not buy Apple products you are not and will not be satisfied with. New MacBook Pro is expensive and has a hated Touchbar? New MacBook Air will do performance wise or old MacBook Pro 2015? Then do not buy a 2016 MBP, but the one that does suite you, and write about your decision on a forum, blog etc.



  3. Analyse really carefully your 'musts', mustn'ts' and needs.



    In the question it states: "I must use a Mac". And then it lists a few 'reasons' to which I would still ask further: "Why, really?" The specifics are missing, really. Because you might opt for a Hackintosh or a virtualisation solution for almost everything Mac-only in terms of software.



    If it's just about the software to be run, then the two alternatives are worth looking into. If there are other reasons like policy or support within a team or company, then you might ask for exceptions.



  4. Try to look into workarounds. Hate the keyboard: try an external bluetooth. Hate the glossy screen… in general, try any hack you find.



  5. Join groups that have a shared goal for this kind of action.



    To&From Apple: Want a "greener laptop": work with Greenpeace to exert pressure. Want a "right to repair": support proposals for such legislation. Want a usable keyboard as your last butterfly one failed for the third time: join law suits and write about it.



    To&From your work groups: join a union or smaller group that fights for your right to choose the hardware you want, as long as it doesn't hamper the workflow or other policies.








share|improve this answer


























  • Thanks but in the question I did mention the must: the (larger) companies it [linux] is not supported (security apps, wifi, productivity apps etc) The OP was updated to emphasize that more.

    – javadba
    46 mins ago













  • @javadba For one, the above is for the generalised case (you are not alone in this, trust me). Second, unless specified, things like "SecurityApps" sound strange, are they in-house Mac-only (and asking for support/exceptions would still be on the table then, imho)? How can "WiFi" be mac-specific? So, is it really mac-only: like a security app that somehow leverages some T2 functionality already (fictional example) or 'only mac-supported' (but doable with alternatives). If it's killer app (for me it's only one really) that could go VirtualBox? Point 3 and the situation specifics are kickers

    – LangLangC
    39 mins ago











  • OK well I upvoted this answer too - it's well thought out. Will wait for more ideas before awarding.

    – javadba
    28 mins ago














2












2








2







It's really imperative to observe a few things:



You want new hardware, and prefer Apple building it for you. That means choosing the right one for you, or influence Apple to cater to your needs, or make a compromise in needs, or look for workarounds and alternatives.





  1. Voice your wants and demands. Not necessarily just here (if this community even tolerates something like this and doesn't qualify it as "just a rant").



    But do two other things:

    write it directly to Apple (Feedback), and write to news outlets, magazines, blogs, your own pages. It is absolutely superfluous to cry and whine in private only to go out and pay good money for things you do not really want or need or like. Chances that this succeeds are small, but then at least you have tried and if others chime in in significant enough numbers, then maybe…



    Apple can see the numbers of sales, but not the non-sales. It can count complaints written to them or analysing reviews and net trends. Writing to them and the public increases the likelihood to have that opinion registered and properly weighted. If buyers rip the boxes off the shelves, you are indeed in an insignificant demographic. If sales slow and negative press increases, any intelligent business will have to adapt, somehow.



    If you buy from an online retailer, write a review that list your likes and dislikes fairly. Only praising a product is common, but absolutely uselesss, unlesss you're interested primarily in stock-market shares.



    Well written and constructive criticism is the most helpful thing to do. It helps others form an opinion and make a decision. And that includes Apple.



    But you have to be patient and wait, for a thing that may never materialise.



  2. Do not buy Apple products you are not and will not be satisfied with. New MacBook Pro is expensive and has a hated Touchbar? New MacBook Air will do performance wise or old MacBook Pro 2015? Then do not buy a 2016 MBP, but the one that does suite you, and write about your decision on a forum, blog etc.



  3. Analyse really carefully your 'musts', mustn'ts' and needs.



    In the question it states: "I must use a Mac". And then it lists a few 'reasons' to which I would still ask further: "Why, really?" The specifics are missing, really. Because you might opt for a Hackintosh or a virtualisation solution for almost everything Mac-only in terms of software.



    If it's just about the software to be run, then the two alternatives are worth looking into. If there are other reasons like policy or support within a team or company, then you might ask for exceptions.



  4. Try to look into workarounds. Hate the keyboard: try an external bluetooth. Hate the glossy screen… in general, try any hack you find.



  5. Join groups that have a shared goal for this kind of action.



    To&From Apple: Want a "greener laptop": work with Greenpeace to exert pressure. Want a "right to repair": support proposals for such legislation. Want a usable keyboard as your last butterfly one failed for the third time: join law suits and write about it.



    To&From your work groups: join a union or smaller group that fights for your right to choose the hardware you want, as long as it doesn't hamper the workflow or other policies.








share|improve this answer















It's really imperative to observe a few things:



You want new hardware, and prefer Apple building it for you. That means choosing the right one for you, or influence Apple to cater to your needs, or make a compromise in needs, or look for workarounds and alternatives.





  1. Voice your wants and demands. Not necessarily just here (if this community even tolerates something like this and doesn't qualify it as "just a rant").



    But do two other things:

    write it directly to Apple (Feedback), and write to news outlets, magazines, blogs, your own pages. It is absolutely superfluous to cry and whine in private only to go out and pay good money for things you do not really want or need or like. Chances that this succeeds are small, but then at least you have tried and if others chime in in significant enough numbers, then maybe…



    Apple can see the numbers of sales, but not the non-sales. It can count complaints written to them or analysing reviews and net trends. Writing to them and the public increases the likelihood to have that opinion registered and properly weighted. If buyers rip the boxes off the shelves, you are indeed in an insignificant demographic. If sales slow and negative press increases, any intelligent business will have to adapt, somehow.



    If you buy from an online retailer, write a review that list your likes and dislikes fairly. Only praising a product is common, but absolutely uselesss, unlesss you're interested primarily in stock-market shares.



    Well written and constructive criticism is the most helpful thing to do. It helps others form an opinion and make a decision. And that includes Apple.



    But you have to be patient and wait, for a thing that may never materialise.



  2. Do not buy Apple products you are not and will not be satisfied with. New MacBook Pro is expensive and has a hated Touchbar? New MacBook Air will do performance wise or old MacBook Pro 2015? Then do not buy a 2016 MBP, but the one that does suite you, and write about your decision on a forum, blog etc.



  3. Analyse really carefully your 'musts', mustn'ts' and needs.



    In the question it states: "I must use a Mac". And then it lists a few 'reasons' to which I would still ask further: "Why, really?" The specifics are missing, really. Because you might opt for a Hackintosh or a virtualisation solution for almost everything Mac-only in terms of software.



    If it's just about the software to be run, then the two alternatives are worth looking into. If there are other reasons like policy or support within a team or company, then you might ask for exceptions.



  4. Try to look into workarounds. Hate the keyboard: try an external bluetooth. Hate the glossy screen… in general, try any hack you find.



  5. Join groups that have a shared goal for this kind of action.



    To&From Apple: Want a "greener laptop": work with Greenpeace to exert pressure. Want a "right to repair": support proposals for such legislation. Want a usable keyboard as your last butterfly one failed for the third time: join law suits and write about it.



    To&From your work groups: join a union or smaller group that fights for your right to choose the hardware you want, as long as it doesn't hamper the workflow or other policies.









share|improve this answer














share|improve this answer



share|improve this answer








edited 1 min ago

























answered 51 mins ago









LangLangCLangLangC

4,25531757




4,25531757













  • Thanks but in the question I did mention the must: the (larger) companies it [linux] is not supported (security apps, wifi, productivity apps etc) The OP was updated to emphasize that more.

    – javadba
    46 mins ago













  • @javadba For one, the above is for the generalised case (you are not alone in this, trust me). Second, unless specified, things like "SecurityApps" sound strange, are they in-house Mac-only (and asking for support/exceptions would still be on the table then, imho)? How can "WiFi" be mac-specific? So, is it really mac-only: like a security app that somehow leverages some T2 functionality already (fictional example) or 'only mac-supported' (but doable with alternatives). If it's killer app (for me it's only one really) that could go VirtualBox? Point 3 and the situation specifics are kickers

    – LangLangC
    39 mins ago











  • OK well I upvoted this answer too - it's well thought out. Will wait for more ideas before awarding.

    – javadba
    28 mins ago



















  • Thanks but in the question I did mention the must: the (larger) companies it [linux] is not supported (security apps, wifi, productivity apps etc) The OP was updated to emphasize that more.

    – javadba
    46 mins ago













  • @javadba For one, the above is for the generalised case (you are not alone in this, trust me). Second, unless specified, things like "SecurityApps" sound strange, are they in-house Mac-only (and asking for support/exceptions would still be on the table then, imho)? How can "WiFi" be mac-specific? So, is it really mac-only: like a security app that somehow leverages some T2 functionality already (fictional example) or 'only mac-supported' (but doable with alternatives). If it's killer app (for me it's only one really) that could go VirtualBox? Point 3 and the situation specifics are kickers

    – LangLangC
    39 mins ago











  • OK well I upvoted this answer too - it's well thought out. Will wait for more ideas before awarding.

    – javadba
    28 mins ago

















Thanks but in the question I did mention the must: the (larger) companies it [linux] is not supported (security apps, wifi, productivity apps etc) The OP was updated to emphasize that more.

– javadba
46 mins ago







Thanks but in the question I did mention the must: the (larger) companies it [linux] is not supported (security apps, wifi, productivity apps etc) The OP was updated to emphasize that more.

– javadba
46 mins ago















@javadba For one, the above is for the generalised case (you are not alone in this, trust me). Second, unless specified, things like "SecurityApps" sound strange, are they in-house Mac-only (and asking for support/exceptions would still be on the table then, imho)? How can "WiFi" be mac-specific? So, is it really mac-only: like a security app that somehow leverages some T2 functionality already (fictional example) or 'only mac-supported' (but doable with alternatives). If it's killer app (for me it's only one really) that could go VirtualBox? Point 3 and the situation specifics are kickers

– LangLangC
39 mins ago





@javadba For one, the above is for the generalised case (you are not alone in this, trust me). Second, unless specified, things like "SecurityApps" sound strange, are they in-house Mac-only (and asking for support/exceptions would still be on the table then, imho)? How can "WiFi" be mac-specific? So, is it really mac-only: like a security app that somehow leverages some T2 functionality already (fictional example) or 'only mac-supported' (but doable with alternatives). If it's killer app (for me it's only one really) that could go VirtualBox? Point 3 and the situation specifics are kickers

– LangLangC
39 mins ago













OK well I upvoted this answer too - it's well thought out. Will wait for more ideas before awarding.

– javadba
28 mins ago





OK well I upvoted this answer too - it's well thought out. Will wait for more ideas before awarding.

– javadba
28 mins ago


















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